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	<title>Comments for Mormon Mentality</title>
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	<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org</link>
	<description>Thoughts and Asides by Peculiar People</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 09:31:24 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>Comment on Thoughts on Everlasting Hell: The Case for Pageants by Jeff Bennion</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2008/08/27/thoughts-on-everlasting-hell-the-case-for-pageants.htm#comment-90027</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff Bennion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 05:45:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=938#comment-90027</guid>
		<description>I'll venture this defense. I had a great time all three times I went to the Hill Cumorah Pageant, and the hospitality and obvious spiritual devotion of the local Saints won me over so much that any flaws in the pageant pale in comparison. 

And I think the score, by an exceptional talent among the Mormons, Crawford Gates, is excellent.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll venture this defense. I had a great time all three times I went to the Hill Cumorah Pageant, and the hospitality and obvious spiritual devotion of the local Saints won me over so much that any flaws in the pageant pale in comparison. </p>
<p>And I think the score, by an exceptional talent among the Mormons, Crawford Gates, is excellent.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Thoughts on the Democratic Convention by Jeff Bennion</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2008/08/27/thoughts-on-the-convention.htm#comment-90026</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff Bennion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 05:38:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=939#comment-90026</guid>
		<description>Not sure how far we can take the Ted Kennedy/Alexander Hamilton comparison. Scandal? Check. Illicit sex? Check. Deaths under shady circumstances? Check. Great deal of influence? Check. Bastards? Check. Unsteady and erratic? Check. Courageous in the face of physical danger? Check. Winebibbers? You betcha.

But brilliant intellect with ideas that will last generations and help bind and preserve the Republic? Uh, no. Not even close.

I'm not too bothered by the Greek temple thing, or even the quasi-Presidential seal. I may even vote for the guy. But honestly, it's the zeal of some of his supporters that creeps me out the most, and all I can say about that music video you link to is, "eeew". Some of this stuff reminds me of what Mussolini used to do. It's unseemly to see in proletarian America, and I'm afraid, it validates some of what Jonah Goldberg tried to say in his book Liberal Fascists that many on the left (though not exclusively on the left) are very prone to hero worship of their political leaders. I am sick to death of all this rhapsodizing about Reagan, but at least the Republicans wait until their leaders are dead (to say nothing of actually having been elected) before they deify them!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not sure how far we can take the Ted Kennedy/Alexander Hamilton comparison. Scandal? Check. Illicit sex? Check. Deaths under shady circumstances? Check. Great deal of influence? Check. Bastards? Check. Unsteady and erratic? Check. Courageous in the face of physical danger? Check. Winebibbers? You betcha.</p>
<p>But brilliant intellect with ideas that will last generations and help bind and preserve the Republic? Uh, no. Not even close.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not too bothered by the Greek temple thing, or even the quasi-Presidential seal. I may even vote for the guy. But honestly, it&#8217;s the zeal of some of his supporters that creeps me out the most, and all I can say about that music video you link to is, &#8220;eeew&#8221;. Some of this stuff reminds me of what Mussolini used to do. It&#8217;s unseemly to see in proletarian America, and I&#8217;m afraid, it validates some of what Jonah Goldberg tried to say in his book Liberal Fascists that many on the left (though not exclusively on the left) are very prone to hero worship of their political leaders. I am sick to death of all this rhapsodizing about Reagan, but at least the Republicans wait until their leaders are dead (to say nothing of actually having been elected) before they deify them!</p>
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		<title>Comment on The FAIR Conference and the Amateur Spirit by Jeff Bennion</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2008/08/27/the-fair-conference-and-the-amateur-spirit.htm#comment-90025</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff Bennion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 05:16:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=933#comment-90025</guid>
		<description>TT:

Orwell is right when he says that Boorstin isn't saying professionals should have no place, or that they shouldn't exist. But that there should always be room for talented amateur enthusiasts as well. The problem isn't professionalism, but a tendency among certain professionals to look down their noses at anyone not in the guild. Einstein was a patent clerk when he wrote his first papers, and many amateur astronomers today are doing great and valuable work. Professionals need to make sure they leave room for and welcome amateurs who can bring a freshness and vitality to their fields.

There was a wonderful example of this at the FAIR Conference. I know it has 'apologetics' in the title, but most of the sessions were not apologetic in character. Newell Bringhurst and Craig Foster had a presentation on the White Horse Prophecy that was not apologetic, for instance. Bringhurst, a professional historian of 25 years, approvingly cited a paper on the White Horse Prophecy by George Cobabe, who, though he holds two degrees, was working as an insurance salesman when he wrote it. 

Later during a break after their session, Bringhurst and Cobabe were having a very congenial and interesting discussion, and again, Bringhurst was very complimentary about Cobabe's work.

It would have been easy for Bringhurst to ignore or denigrate the work of an outsider, but the fact is Cobabe has done some fine work in this area, even though he's not a professional historian. It's that kind of openness to amateurs that I saw over and over at the conference that was so heartwarming. By the way, you can read Cobabe's paper &lt;a href="http://www.fairlds.org/pubs/whitehorse.pdf" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.

Tagore:

Thanks for the pointer to Nibley's article. I had missed that one. I loved this quote: "Official credentials, a foolproof shield against criticism and scrutiny, were naturally coveted most by those who needed them most: it was the poorly qualified who clamored for the status symbol of the degree."

Truly confident and competent professionals aren't threatened by amateurs. They welcome their input and contributions. And as TT points out, many of them are in their fields because they love them. More power to them!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>TT:</p>
<p>Orwell is right when he says that Boorstin isn&#8217;t saying professionals should have no place, or that they shouldn&#8217;t exist. But that there should always be room for talented amateur enthusiasts as well. The problem isn&#8217;t professionalism, but a tendency among certain professionals to look down their noses at anyone not in the guild. Einstein was a patent clerk when he wrote his first papers, and many amateur astronomers today are doing great and valuable work. Professionals need to make sure they leave room for and welcome amateurs who can bring a freshness and vitality to their fields.</p>
<p>There was a wonderful example of this at the FAIR Conference. I know it has &#8216;apologetics&#8217; in the title, but most of the sessions were not apologetic in character. Newell Bringhurst and Craig Foster had a presentation on the White Horse Prophecy that was not apologetic, for instance. Bringhurst, a professional historian of 25 years, approvingly cited a paper on the White Horse Prophecy by George Cobabe, who, though he holds two degrees, was working as an insurance salesman when he wrote it. </p>
<p>Later during a break after their session, Bringhurst and Cobabe were having a very congenial and interesting discussion, and again, Bringhurst was very complimentary about Cobabe&#8217;s work.</p>
<p>It would have been easy for Bringhurst to ignore or denigrate the work of an outsider, but the fact is Cobabe has done some fine work in this area, even though he&#8217;s not a professional historian. It&#8217;s that kind of openness to amateurs that I saw over and over at the conference that was so heartwarming. By the way, you can read Cobabe&#8217;s paper <a href="http://www.fairlds.org/pubs/whitehorse.pdf" rel="nofollow">here</a>.</p>
<p>Tagore:</p>
<p>Thanks for the pointer to Nibley&#8217;s article. I had missed that one. I loved this quote: &#8220;Official credentials, a foolproof shield against criticism and scrutiny, were naturally coveted most by those who needed them most: it was the poorly qualified who clamored for the status symbol of the degree.&#8221;</p>
<p>Truly confident and competent professionals aren&#8217;t threatened by amateurs. They welcome their input and contributions. And as TT points out, many of them are in their fields because they love them. More power to them!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Thoughts on Everlasting Hell: The Case for Pageants by KyleM</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2008/08/27/thoughts-on-everlasting-hell-the-case-for-pageants.htm#comment-90024</link>
		<dc:creator>KyleM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 04:41:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=938#comment-90024</guid>
		<description>"Until then I’ll just say that you’re all a bunch of cultural Philistines, then duck for cover."

Does that make one of us a cultural giant?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Until then I’ll just say that you’re all a bunch of cultural Philistines, then duck for cover.&#8221;</p>
<p>Does that make one of us a cultural giant?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Thoughts on Everlasting Hell: The Case for Pageants by BrianJ</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2008/08/27/thoughts-on-everlasting-hell-the-case-for-pageants.htm#comment-90023</link>
		<dc:creator>BrianJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 04:40:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=938#comment-90023</guid>
		<description>ESO, can you shoot me an email? (You have my address in the admin I presume, but just in case: zimbaim at yahoo dot com.) I only moved from the Brighton/4th ward about 4 months ago.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ESO, can you shoot me an email? (You have my address in the admin I presume, but just in case: zimbaim at yahoo dot com.) I only moved from the Brighton/4th ward about 4 months ago.</p>
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		<title>Comment on &#8220;Strange&#8221; Odd Jobs And Spiritual Experiences by Left Field</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2008/08/26/strange-odd-jobs-and-spiritual-experiences.htm#comment-90022</link>
		<dc:creator>Left Field</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 04:24:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=932#comment-90022</guid>
		<description>Devyn,

That was in about 1990, so she would have been teaching at that university for 40-some years.  I am now teaching at a Catholic and historically Black university.  

John, both BYU and my postdoctoral institution had the same rules Devyn mentioned respecting the cadavers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Devyn,</p>
<p>That was in about 1990, so she would have been teaching at that university for 40-some years.  I am now teaching at a Catholic and historically Black university.  </p>
<p>John, both BYU and my postdoctoral institution had the same rules Devyn mentioned respecting the cadavers.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Thoughts on the Democratic Convention by DKL</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2008/08/27/thoughts-on-the-convention.htm#comment-90021</link>
		<dc:creator>DKL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 04:14:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=939#comment-90021</guid>
		<description>Awesome. Once again, I'm glad we cleared than one up:

Next question:

&lt;b&gt;ECS:&lt;/b&gt; &lt;i&gt;...imagery is a sublimation of precisely...&lt;/i&gt;

Again: Are you talking about you or me?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Awesome. Once again, I&#8217;m glad we cleared than one up:</p>
<p>Next question:</p>
<p><b>ECS:</b> <i>&#8230;imagery is a sublimation of precisely&#8230;</i></p>
<p>Again: Are you talking about you or me?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Thoughts on the Democratic Convention by ECS</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2008/08/27/thoughts-on-the-convention.htm#comment-90020</link>
		<dc:creator>ECS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 04:10:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=939#comment-90020</guid>
		<description>I'm talking about the hyperbole that Democrats use tirelessly.  But if the shoe fits...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m talking about the hyperbole that Democrats use tirelessly.  But if the shoe fits&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on Thoughts on the Democratic Convention by DKL</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2008/08/27/thoughts-on-the-convention.htm#comment-90019</link>
		<dc:creator>DKL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 04:08:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=939#comment-90019</guid>
		<description>Great. I'm glad we cleared that one up.

Next question:

&lt;b&gt;ECS:&lt;/b&gt; &lt;i&gt;Republicans are dangerously insane and should be locked up for safety’s sake. &lt;/i&gt;

Again, are you talking about you or me?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great. I&#8217;m glad we cleared that one up.</p>
<p>Next question:</p>
<p><b>ECS:</b> <i>Republicans are dangerously insane and should be locked up for safety’s sake. </i></p>
<p>Again, are you talking about you or me?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Thoughts on the Democratic Convention by ECS</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2008/08/27/thoughts-on-the-convention.htm#comment-90018</link>
		<dc:creator>ECS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Aug 2008 04:01:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=939#comment-90018</guid>
		<description>I'm not the one who brought up the Greek temples.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not the one who brought up the Greek temples.</p>
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